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Transcript
of Live Chat with
Vilmos Zsigmond, ASC
June
1, 2002
Note: This
chat was conducted at ShowBiz Expo at the Los Angeles Convention. Questions
were accepted from both our online chat guests and the assembled audience.
ShowBiz Expo Audience
indicates that question was submitted from one of our guests on-site.
Moderator (Jun 1, 2002 1:20:38 PM)
Welcome. We're chatting with Vilmos Zsigmond, ASC live from the Demo
Stage of Showbiz Expo 2002 at the LA Convention Center.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:24:30 PM)
I'd like to greet everybody here and around the world, who's interested
in the world of cinematography.
muscatel (Jun 1, 2002 1:24:33 PM)
Good morning, Vilmos. I recently saw the restored version of The
Hired Hand at the Tribeca festival in N.Y. The film was a work of
art. Peter Fonda, Verna Bloom and Frank Mazzola spoke to the audience
afterwards, and all said the magic was due to a collaboration of the
talent of everyone involved. What was it like working with Peter? And
how did the editor, Mr. Mazzola, enhance your work?
 Vilmos
Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:25:14 PM)
I had a great time working with Peter. Peter is a great actor. He never
directed anything before actually, and the first two weeks I had a difficult
time teaching him. My task was really to try to teach him enough in
two weeks that he would be able to do his job as a director. Which he
actually did, and then took over.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:26:02 PM)
So much that he then would say, stop, I'm the director now. If I'm doing
it wrong, tell me and I'll correct it.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:26:27 PM)
Talking a bit about Mr. Mazzola; he was an incredible editor. And I
didn't imagine he would do those beautiful montage scenes. He mentioned
something at the beginning but at the end, when he cut it together,
I realized his contribution was so tremendous.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:26:55 PM)
I never before worked with an editor who put his stamp on a movie so
much. If you see the movie today, you will realize it's 40 years ahead
of its time. He's still promoting the movie around the world. It was
shown at the Venice Film Festival and in London also.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:27:39 PM)
It's going to be shown at the Seattle Film Festival a week from now.
There are other plans also.
Glowbug (Jun 1, 2002 1:27:48 PM)
Hi Vilmos, I would first like to say you've had an amazing career. Your
body of work is among the finest in filmmaking history. How do you think
the advent of digital media will affect the way you work?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:28:17 PM)
Actually, digital filmmaking should not really alter the art of cinematography.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:28:37 PM)
I know everybody is afraid post-production facilities and people will
take over and decide to make a film something it wasn't intended to
be. I don't think it will affect cinematographers as much as directors.
 Vilmos
Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:28:54 PM)
I think we welcome everything that can be done to a movie in post-production.
Like Hired Hand the post-production with Mazzola's editing.
I think it enhanced it 50 times, though that wasn't digital. We can
correct our colors better, correct mistakes we did in the shooting.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:29:45 PM)
You know, many times you work under severe weather conditions. It's
raining, you start with overcast and then it's sunny and then back to
overcast again. With digital we can improve things so much, we can match
shots. Don't be afraid of digital.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:30:20 PM)
Directors will ask questions why are you using so many lights. I thought
digital photography didn't need so many lights? You can shoot available.
Well, true, you can shoot available light. We can shoot available light
with fast films. You can do everything in film as you can digital. So
what is the difference?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:31:16 PM)
Actually, I think you need more lights, better lighting, in order to
make the digital photography as good as film photography.
Jim Beau (Jun 1, 2002 1:31:23 PM)
The long-awaited DVD of McCabe & Mrs. Miller comes out tomorrow.
Were you involved in the transfer?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:31:47 PM)
I definitely was involved with the transfer. I would like to be involved
in the transfer of any of my old movies. I want studios to call me because
we can help with the DVD.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:32:18 PM)
Recently with The Long Goodbye, either they couldn't reach me
or felt they didn't have to call me. They called me for the interview
and I asked them about the transfer. They said, alright, let's correct
this mistake and showed me what they did and it was all wrong.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:33:15 PM)
When we shot The Long Goodbye, we shot in a style with a lot
of flashing and diffusion. I pushed the film. With digital post-production
they eliminated that look and it looked like we shot the movie yesterday.
It was contrasty. It looked okay, but it wasn't the way I shot it. But
they said they wanted to satisfy me, and so we did the whole transfer
over the next week and now it looks the way we shot it.
Panasmith (Jun 1, 2002 1:33:51 PM)
How was it shooting a film like Ghosts in the Darkness, was it
a long shoot? How did you crew hold up? did you have many problems?
 Vilmos
Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:34:39 PM)
It was very difficult, because we were in South Africa, and the equipment
was not really first rate. It was a little bit under that. We didn't
have a Moscow light. I would have needed sometimes four Moscow lights
to shoot our set, which was built on location. It was probably a square
mile basically. And we had some night shooting. I tried to do a lot
of them at dusk, with sort of dusk for night.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:35:59 PM)
But we had a problem when we had to shoot in total darkness. We used
a lot of fires, and torches. It was very difficult to shoot the dark
night. That's usually all cinematographers' problem when you have to
shoot night and make it believable. That it doesn't look lit. If you
use too many lights, strong lights, it makes it look like a bad movie.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:36:42 PM)
I try to avoid that if I can. The shoot was quite long. I think we were
there for 3-1/2 months shooting. And we had problems with the lions
because, of course ,you could not shoot the lions you cannot tell
them what to do and how to do it.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:37:09 PM)
One lion was especially good for us, a very gentle lion. He could do
tricks he would jump on his trainer, who had put a piece of meat in
the trainer's pocket. Imagine a 500-lb lion jumping on your chest. Also,
the trainer was a Hungarian also, so he was a bit crazy.
Ken (Jun 1, 2002 1:37:50 PM)
In Close Encounters the use of lighting to portray the space
craft was a key to its being credible. What kind of problems did that
effect pose for you?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:38:42 PM)
In Close Encounters, the special effects were really difficult
because we didn't have digital post production yet. With digital, it
would have been a snap, but in those days everything had to be optical
effects. We had a genius, Doug Tremble, who really helped us get wonderful
effects. Sometimes he had to make 9 or 10 passes on the same negative,
which is why we had to use 65mm film.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:39:45 PM)
We were very proud of this film, because that was the first time you
saw a special effects movie, and you could not tell the difference between
a piece of film that had the special effects and what didn't. Before
that you always saw grain jumping, and it was always a second rate quality.
People could tell ah ha, coming to an effect again. With Close
Encounters, you could not tell that. All the film had exactly the
same quality.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:40:34 PM)
To do that, we decided to destroy a little the original footage. We
pushed the film, over-developed it, to get a bit more grain, a little
funkier looking. Even if you shot on 65mm film, with all the effects,
we knew it wouldn't have 100percent quality, maybe 75percent for the
quality. For the effects. That's why the whole movie looks the same
and people think the UFOs are real.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:41:19 PM)
As far as the lighting goes, we had to use a lot of lighting. We figured
out that if there ARE UFOs, and I think there are UFOs, but unfortunately,
we haven't seen them landing yet. At least I haven't seen it.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:41:55 PM)
But we imagined if the UFOs were landing, when the door opens there
would be an incredible amount of light. They are living in the future,
with better technology. With a lot of lighting etc.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:42:43 PM)
My biggest problem was when the spaceship door opens, maybe 150 feet
wide or something, and an incredible amount of light is coming out.
How to create that effect?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:43:07 PM)
The production designer tried using about 1000 lightbulbs but the
door opened and nothing happened. The individual lights didn't give
the effect. So we decided to use bollow spots about eight of them.
And we used fog, because light rays only basically show up if you have
an atmosphere. And we realized it still didn't do the job. Then somebody
came up with the idea maybe we should use mirrors, maybe if we break
the mirrors into pieces, it will break the light into individual shafts
of light.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:44:27 PM)
Once you did that, it became the incredible effect when the people are
coming down the ramp and they are surrounded by millions of light rays.
That was my favorite scene in the movie, because magic was created at
that moment.
Tamas Bojtor (Jun 1, 2002 1:44:40 PM)
Vilmos!! Just connecting to the subject you're talking about now....the
director I'm about to work with has the option to use 24p, or 35mm....she
is asking me which one to choose....well, which one would you choose
with all the knowledge you've accumulated?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:45:22 PM)
I think that's an easy question do you have the money to shoot on
film?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:45:35 PM)
That's the only criteria. If you want the best quality for a motion
picture, at the moment, you still have to shoot on film. There's no
other way to get the quality on screen.
 Vilmos
Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:45:56 PM)
For somebody who doesn't have enough money, I would not tell him to
use film, because it does take more money. But I hope that eventually
everybody will have enough to shoot on film. But if you don't shoot
on whatever 16mm, digital, whatever but the story must be done,
one way or the other.
Misha (Jun 1, 2002 1:46:32 PM)
Good morning Vilmos. I am a big fan of yours and am looking forward
to hearing you in person at the events that you will be attending at
the Seattle International Film Festival. I hope also to meet you in
person at these events. I was wondering if you could talk about the
flashing process which you first used in McCabe and Mrs. Miller.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:47:10 PM)
When I met Robert Altman, he wanted to have a special look for the movie.
He explained to me he would like it to look like old faded pictures,
with saturated colors.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:47:20 PM)
The movie should look as if it were shot in 1890, when there was no
camera and no film. But if there was a camera and film, that's how it
would look today. It was very clear what he wanted. And it just happened
that I was already involved in testing flashing.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:47:52 PM)
I didn't invent it. Fred Young was the first one who used it in a movie
called The Deadly Affair.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:48:03 PM)
And it just happened that Cinematographer Magazine had an article,
and I knew it would be incredible when we are shooting under low lighting
conditions. You can get more exposure into the shadows. You can sort
of see in to the dark.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:48:53 PM)
And since McCabe & Mrs. Miller was made in the late 1800s,
when you only had candlelight, fire effects, lanterns, I thought it
would be great. I told Altman about it, and Altman being really the
ultimate researcher in new looks, he immediately got it and said, that
sounds great, let's do it. And that's how it began.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:49:29 PM)
We had to do tests what kind of deterioration of the film did we want?
10 percent 20 percent? 25 percent?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:49:48 PM)
We actually decided we would treat each scene differently, whatever
that scene requires. More flashing or less flashing. Eventually we ended
up between 10 percent and 25 percent all the way through the film.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:50:16 PM)
There was the very end sequence where we didn't flash the film, because
we wanted it to be really stark and real. That's where Warren Beatty
as McCabe dies and Julie Christy is in an opium den.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:50:51 PM)
Since we thought that the film has to be more dramatic and a little
bit reminiscent of today, our times. So to bring it back from a period
film and really make it look real. That's why the film starts out very
hazy, it's raining. And in the end it's very stark and real.
zsigmond daughter (Jun 1, 2002 1:51:25 PM)
What do you have in the works now?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:51:48 PM)
My daughter is always interested in what I'm doing next she's always
dying to see my next movie. Unfortunately, I'm not so busy now, like
a lot of people in Hollywood.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:52:11 PM)
I did a movie last year called Bank Ban and that was an opera
film. It's just finished. We did the English subtitles in Hungary, and
we will have a presentation next month for a few people. Hopefully we
will find someone who wants to release the film, which may be difficult
because I don't know how many people are interested in opera.
 Vilmos
Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:53:24 PM)
Anyhow, I had a great time shooting that movie because I went to my
home country and found an incredible crew. We shot it in six weeks.
Not a long schedule, but the enthusiasm of those people was incredible.
It's a Hungarian national treasure, this opera film. Great music, great
singing.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:54:46 PM)
We have great stars two well-known singers Ava Marton and Andrea Rost
if you see operas in New York or Los Angeles you will know them. I
have great hope that Americas finally will be able to listen to a Hungarian
opera, which I don't think anyone has ever seen or heard here in the
United States.
Tamas Bojtor (Jun 1, 2002 1:55:02 PM)
When I was home recently, they were showing Bank Ban .....do
you wish you could have worked more in Hungary over the years? and how
did the hungarian crew differ from the US crews?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:56:14 PM)
Yes, I wish I could have done more in Hungary. I left in 1956 and the
only time I went back to shoot a movie was in 1991 when I did a part
of Stalin, the HBO movie. We did 3 weeks in Hungary and 6 weeks
in Moscow. That's when I met my gaffer in Hungary, who's my friend today.
He's a wonderful gaffer and he collects people around him who are not
laborers.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:56:49 PM)
You are used to that out of the US that you probably find 1 or 2 good
electricians, but the rest are laborers. Richey collects electricians
and he teaches them and it's like in Hollywood, where everyone is really
good, they can set lights, they can set barn doors, and flags.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:57:35 PM)
In Hungary, the flags are set by electricians. I'm changing that, because
I'm trying to teach them you have to have a grip dept. The grips were
only pushing the dolly or working around the camera, and all the grip
work was done by electricians.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:58:06 PM)
I'm trying to teach them to get into the American system not the British.
And it works much better, faster, more efficient. I must say my crew
was so good I didn't actually miss my American crew. I don't like to
say that because I love my crew in Hollywood, but the budget was so
small we could not actually have paid them.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 1:58:42 PM)
What criteria do you use when deciding on a production? Script, director,
challenge?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:59:04 PM)
All these. Script is very important for me. I want to be involved with
the story. If the story has nothing to say to me, or the audiences,
I don't think that picture should be made. I think what is that picture
for? Who's going to enjoy it? That's the most important.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 1:59:34 PM)
Second, for me is working with a director I like. True, it's easy to
work with somebody I've worked before. But it not often happens today.
Many times I have to start with a new director. So it's important to
find out if you are thinking alike.
 Vilmos
Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:00:20 PM)
I can follow directions, it's easy. I think a cinematographer has to
do the director's movie. You cannot make two movies. I can't take over
the director's job. It's unfair but it's also not good. A movie should
have one vision. I am there to help that vision come through.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:00:53 PM)
When you get together with a director the first time, you have a conversation
for about a half hour. We will know immediately if we want to work together.
Many times the relationship ends there and we we'll never work together
because aren't suited. The challenge, of course, is always important.
I think we have to be challenged. We must be.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:01:51 PM)
Like the Lakers had to be challenged last night!
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:02:07 PM)
I have to be challenged with something difficult but it's important
to get it right so it will be a good picture the audience will like.
That happened many times in my career where the challenge was immense.
Like Deerhunter, Close Encounters.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:02:58 PM)
Or Witches of Eastwick I don't usually do comedies, but it
was challenge. On many of the movies like Ghost in the Darkness
the biggest challenge there was the weather. We were shooting in a
stormy season in Africa. The sun would come out for 5 minutes then go
in, then it was raining. And we had a schedule to follow? What to do?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:03:37 PM)
The schedule is probably more important than anything else. You have
to finish the movie, because that's all the money the producer has.
So that's a challenge to overcome those problems the lions who wouldn't
do what we wanted. We had some animatronic lions who wouldn't do what
we wanted to.
David Walpole (Jun 1, 2002 2:04:08 PM)
In regards to Deliverance...what do you remember as the most
difficult sequence to shoot & why?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:04:46 PM)
The most difficult sequence there were a lot but looking at the
film someone would think the most difficult was to shoot the canoes
going through very rough water. That was a challenge actually to capture
that for the audience, the way you feel you are in the canoe. You can
turn over, go under water, maybe stay under for 30 seconds. So that
was a physical challenge as to how to portray that.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:05:29 PM)
John Boorman and myself, we took canoeing lessons for two weeks. Originally
we thought those scenes would be with stunt people, but that would not
be good. Stunt people are great, but you have to hide them. You have
to shoot from a long range or the back, you cannot see facial expressions.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:06:45 PM)
We used a trick. We learned canoeing and when the actors arrived, we
invited them to see what we had done. And they were curious how did
we get so good at canoeing. They said, it's nothing to it if you did
it, we can.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:07:11 PM)
So they got in the canoes and turned over a couple times it took a
while to get used to it. But eventually the actors became very good
at it. And when we started to shoot, we only used stuntmen occasionally.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:07:41 PM)
This was the greatest film about the river it looked real. If films
don't look real, it turns out the audience it's not a good question.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:07:57 PM)
What is your advice to film students? Should they major in still photography,
then go to grad school for cinematography?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:08:31 PM)
I don't know what majoring means you just have to do still photography.
 Vilmos
Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:09:07 PM)
If you start taking pictures at 10, then by 18 you should be a good
photographer. The still photography is a base for cinematography. I
know there are cinematographers who are not great still photographers.
But then they actually need a good director who is really visual and
probably a cinematographer by himself. Also they may need a good operator.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:09:55 PM)
But I think looking at my colleagues, they are all good still photographers.
Like Haskell Wexler or Conrad Hall.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:10:24 PM)
In fact, we are going to have an exhibit pretty soon where cinematographers
are going to enter all ASC members are going to enter one still photograph.
Then we will have an exhibit. It will be interesting to see what subjects
we choose and how good we are.
McC (Jun 1, 2002 2:10:47 PM)
I watched a documentary on Mark Rydell this morning and realized you
had worked with him on several films, including The River. How
difficult was that production, given that you had to control (or not)
a natural river?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:11:20 PM)
I did four movies with Mark. It was great working with him, because
he's really visually oriented and he gives his cinematographers freedom
to help him out. It's not that he needs that help, but he always says,
I don't mind taking advice for anything. In the long run, it's my credit
actually. And that's the way it should be, because he's the one who
collects what is good, from many advisors.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:12:22 PM)
As far as the river sequences, we actually had a great time in Tennessee
because we controlled a whole river. We dammed up the river where our
farm was. All we had to do was call the Tennessee water district and
say, Start giving us water.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:12:48 PM)
Then in two hours we would have a controlled flood. We could flood the
farm and unflood the farm. We could do that easily. Of course, that
was probably a million dollars to build the dam!
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:13:22 PM)
We did that on Deliverance also we had a controlled waterfall. We
had a sequence where the actors leave the control and are swimming for
their lives. The place we worked at Talulah Gorge, there was a dam and
they could control the water coming down our waterfall. It's like being
in a Hollywood Studio. We had an immense amount of water that we didn't
have to pump back up.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:14:20 PM)
Who was the best director you ever worked with and why?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:14:44 PM)
I work with great directors all the time. I really mean that.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:14:50 PM)
I've been lucky. Luck is very important. Skill is one thing we talk
about what great artists we are but we cannot be great artists if
we don't have directors who give us action.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:15:29 PM)
I've worked with Robert Altman and Brian De Palma. I worked with Mark
Rydell for four movies. Steven Spielberg on two. And that doesn't mean
the directors I worked with once or twice were not good directors. Jerry
Schatzberg. Irwin Winkler, who is a producer. He only did three pictures
and the last one I did was Life as a House. I thought he was
a great director. Sometimes it's difficult coming from a producer, but
he manages. Steven Hopkins who did Ghost in the Darkness, an
Australian. Also a terrific director.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:17:24 PM)
I'm sure I didn't mention a lot of others but I've been lucky. The
credit I've got, I have to thank the directors. The credit has to go
many times also to the production designers. They are great helpers.
ShowBix Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:18:42 PM)
As judge for the Lake Arrowhead Int. Film Festival, I learned that you
have personally provided assistance to beginning film creators who are
submitting short films to competitions. This is a contribution of great
importance. Thank you. My question is: How early in pre-production is
it ideal to begin consulting with the Director?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:19:27 PM)
I grew up in Hungary and got into the Hungarian film biz. In Hungary,
the director and cinematographer start from day one together. The moment
the director has a script, first thing he calls the cinematographer,
then they work on everything together. Very unusual. In Hollywood, it's
not that way. Sometimes here I'm lucky I get four weeks of prep.
 Vilmos
Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:20:23 PM)
With Irwin Winkler on Life as a House, when we made the deal
I said I wanted to be there from the beginning. Of course, they could
not pay me for 12 weeks of prep, nobody has that money. But we did it
on and off, weekends, and I was there for every phase. Which was important
because we built a whole neighborhood in Palos Verdes.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:21:25 PM)
So it was important I was there and it was great for me also. We had
discussions almost every day with the production designer. We appreciated
other very much did we need windows, light sources. It was great.
That's the way it should be. It should be continuous work from the beginning.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:22:09 PM)
Unfortunately, the way the business is set up in Hollywood, we are hired
by the week, not the picture. We should be above the line, following
the movie from day one to the end. Especially now we have so much post-production
going on it's very important we follow the movie to the very end.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:22:45 PM)
There are so many things in post where we can improve the movie. I don't
think we're there yet, but I hope that's going to happen.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:23:11 PM)
How has your relationship changed over the years with your operator...
considering how much video assist has improved? And what is your routine
during a take with regard to video assist?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:24:13 PM)
I had a hard time in the beginning with operators in Hollywood because
in Hungary the DP operates. It was so strange for me. I had a tremendous
problem with my union who said I couldn't operate. I was penalized.
It was unbelievable in those days.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:24:48 PM)
But the first step was I found an operator who was willing not to operate.
The union usually didn't know about it, but sometimes there were spies
and they would threaten to throw me out of the union.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:25:37 PM)
But then I went to the next step, sometimes the operator would set up
a second camera and maybe he just wasn't a good operator and so that
didn't work.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:26:34 PM)
So then I made a good operator my assistant. I trained him to be my
assistant Nick McClaine. He became such a good operator, that I didn't
mind to leave the camera for him. And I started to leave him more and
more often. And I realized I could do a better job by concentrating
on the lighting and the politics with the director.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:27:00 PM)
It's important to have a relationship with the director, get involved
with his plans, the next shot, the next day. As a DP it's important
to be up to date with his ideas. I've done that until today. But sometimes
I get itchy and have to get behind the camera.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:27:42 PM)
Instead of the Mickey Mouse video screen, which doesn't show a real
image, sometimes I have to look through the camera. I do that more often
when we use two cameras. And the style today is two cameras. Many times
I end up with the second camera.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:28:31 PM)
So I'm actually trying to help, because usually we don't have a second
operator on low budget movies, which I have been doing lately. So it's
a difficult situation. It's not that I mind to operate the second camera
I love it. Of course, if you are doing $100 million picture then you
can hire 2-3 operators and I don't have to.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:29:26 PM)
With video assist, if I have two operators on the set, occasionally
I will have to watch the replay in order to see if both cameras capture
the scenes I wanted. But I still feel I can see better if I'm standing
next to the camera, watching the real actors, not the picture of the
actors on the video.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:29:58 PM)
Many directors today are stuck by the video monitor, which I think is
totally wrong. You cannot really see real acting on the monitor. It's
small and doesn't have the impact. You can't tell if the actors' performance
was good enough. But go to a studio today, where are you going to find
a director? At the video monitor. Rather than standing next to the camera
and watching that.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:31:06 PM)
It gets to the point in an important scene the actor doesn't go to the
director to see how it was, they go to the DP and ask "How was
I?" because they know you can see the performance better.
Panasmith (Jun 1, 2002 2:31:12 PM)
You recently gave Lazlo his Lifetime achievement award have does it
feel for both of you to have come so far and be so successful? What
was you proudest moment if you could have only one?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:32:00 PM)
When I got my ASC Lifetime Achievement, I was very happy to be respected
by my peers.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:32:35 PM)
However, I was also sad, because Laszlo was not recognized because
we were friends from day one. So when I got my award, I jokingly told
Laszlo he deserved half of it. That's how I felt about it. And then
three years later when Laszlo got it, I was so happy to give it to him.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:32:59 PM)
I was almost crying actually that finally the day had arrived that we
both had the award. And he wanted to give me half back then. So it's
nice to be respected by Hollywood and the world. But without Laszlo
I wouldn't be here, and he probably would say the same thing.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:33:33 PM)
From Deliverance, please describe the techniques used in the
day-for-night cliff-climbing sequence. In addition to the mattes, was
the film solarized? Was flashing used in general?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:34:12 PM)
The Deliverance night scene we tried to accomplish something
nobody had tried. Unfortunately it didn't work 100 percent either. Maybe
90 percent it was a good try.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:34:44 PM)
We wanted to create a white mask of the sky. Usually in day-for-night,
you want the blue sky, use a polarizer filter and maybe graduated filters.
And you try to make it very dark in the printing. That gives you the
night effect. We tested it out and tried to shoot with a white sky and
then in the optical house create a mask of everything which is white.
And then reverse that.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:36:12 PM)
So basically you are double printing where the scene is printed normally
and then print the white sky and everything which his white in the scene
make it dark by printing black into the white areas, and that gives
you a night feeling. Because the white sky became a black sky. And a
sunlight tree becomes black. It's almost like a solarized effect, if
it's not done correctly.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:37:25 PM)
Needless to say the optical house could not do it correctly because
in those days we didn't have a perfect registration in the printers.
So the skies and trees had a sort of white halo around it which many
critics haled as a great discovery.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:38:03 PM)
But I hated it. It might have been a great effect, but it's not what
I wanted. But that's how it turned out. Some of the scenes were perfect
and I didn't understand why sometimes yes and sometimes no.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:38:51 PM)
My favorite shot was when Jon Voight ends up climbing a hill and stands
up and we tilt up the camera into the sky and it's perfect night sky
without any of the halo effect. That's how the whole sequence should
have looked that.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:39:39 PM)
The waterfall in the background, which was mostly white because the
light was shining on the water. There were some highlight details, and
that actually became a dark waterfall. It had a lot of grays and darks.
Sometimes where there were medium tones it stayed medium because the
mask only affected the very highlighted areas. That was really a very
interesting affect.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:40:20 PM)
Today, I think it can be done much better because all you have to do
is select the highlights and tell the computer to make it dark. In Deliverance
it didn't work 100 percent for me, but it will work for you and the
computer.
Tamas Bojtor (Jun 1, 2002 2:40:40 PM)
i think turning the words of the script into images that carry emotions
is probably the essence of filmmaking...how can this process (which
obviously involves the dp just as much as the director) be preserved
with shorter and shorter pre production times?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:42:37 PM)
Its difficult to do with short production times. I think maybe good
digital photography can help us in the future that people can work on
less expensive way in order to lengthen the production. There's no film
in the camera. True at the moment it's a compromise, but if it's done
right, the story is good, actors are good, I still think you can make
a good picture.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:42:49 PM)
But time is working for you. A painter needs enough time to paint his
painting. The director needs time to work with the actors. The actors
need time to rehearse and try different things. If you consider film
as an art form, I think time will work for us.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:43:35 PM)
Movies are a business, super movies, they are done simply to make money.
Unfortunately, that's where I think the digital age the digital post-production
it doesn't really help the art of filmmaking.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:43:59 PM)
We have movies which millions of people see, but I don't call them artistic
films. It's good for making money. But I'm hoping film as an art form
exists today and will exist tomorrow. I'm hoping it will get better
in the future. Whoever makes or whatever it takes to make filmmaking
remain as an art form, I'm for it.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:44:53 PM)
On Close Encounters, how did you collaborate with Steven Spielberg?
On the opening scene, in which the air traffic controllers are crouched
over their screen, the screen is reflecting onto their glasses. This
is brilliant cinematography. Would you like to work with Spielberg again?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:46:17 PM)
Absolutely yes. Of course, if you can work with someone like Spielberg,
it's great. It's good to work with good directors. I don't even mind
if they are so good they don't need your help so much. I understand
that Spielberg makes filmmaking so much that he operates the camera
sometimes. Why not? He's in a position to do it. He knows so much about
filmmaking that he could probably make the movie by himself.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:46:36 PM)
The same with Stanley Kubrick. He was a total filmmaker. He would design
the sets. He would light the sets himself. He would probably do everything.
It's not that he didn't trust other people, but I think he had such
a great vision that he thought only he is the one who could do that.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:47:15 PM)
I don't see anything wrong with that. I don't mind working with someone
who has great ideas. If I could just once a day come up with something
he would accept, I would be happy to improve it. But still, Steven does
let his DP do the lighting.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:48:18 PM)
Lighting, for me, is crucial. That's where we talked a little bit about
those producers who want to shoot digital because they think lighting
isn't necessary anymore. That digital cameras are so sensitive that
you can shoot anywhere any time. Which is true but is it an artistic
effect? That's the question.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:48:47 PM)
A director wants to tell a story, and if it's not a documentary, if
it's a story about people and you have to create mood, you need lighting.
And you will need lighting as long as you make movies. And this is where
the cinematographer's art comes in.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:49:27 PM)
You can tell a good cinematographer by looking at the images and the
mood he created. That's our best tool. The camera move is important,
yes. Everything else is important actually. Everything which tells the
story easier and faster and more artistically is fine. But lighting
is the only thing in which the cinematographer can call that's really
the cinematographer's territory, and we should really keep it that way.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:50:07 PM)
The camera and a beautiful woman: how do you make her look so beautiful?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:50:38 PM)
First, the actors and the women should look beautiful without us even
trying. The beauty actually comes from inside out many times.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:51:01 PM)
For example, Bette Midler, a great actress, a great singer. If you look
at her closely, on the street, at a party, you would think she is not
beautiful. And I was scared at first when I had to photograph her?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:51:25 PM)
I said to Mark Rydell she's the star of The Rose, what the
hell are we going to do?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:51:34 PM)
We tried all sorts of filters, and actually in the tests, nothing really
worked. But the only thing that worked, when we were on the set, and
Mark Rydell said Action! That's when Bette Midler became beautiful.
Because she was an incredible performer and you forget about all the
devices. Because she was beautiful, and that was the secret.
George Spiro Dibie (Jun 1, 2002 2:52:12 PM)
The ICG Film Showcase with short films from the Guild's talented young
cinematographers is screening here at Showbiz Expo tomorrow have you
seen it and what do you think?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:53:13 PM)
I think those films are incredibly wonderfully made, wonderfully shot.
And I was really so surprised because I watch student films and I must
say they are improving every year.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:53:42 PM)
I get to the point where I want to know why am I shooting films anymore
myself? We have all these young people who can do it better. The level
of technical knowledge and the artistic approach is wonderful. I think
we have a future here. All these people show talent.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:54:09 PM)
I haven't seen any movie which is only gimmicky. They are all honest
real films. It's a continuous showing here at Showbiz please see them,
you will be very surprised.
Bob Fisher (Jun 1, 2002 2:54:41 PM)
I understand you started your career credited as William Zsigmond. When
did your name change and why?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:55:41 PM)
My name in Hungary was Vilmos. When I came to the US and was getting
my citizenship, they told me I should change my name. Why? Nobody is
going to be able to learn two difficult names. Vilmos Zsigmond. You
have to change one.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:55:45 PM)
So I made it William. I never really liked it. My friends hated it.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:56:07 PM)
When I worked with Peter Fonda on The Hired Hand he said, Should
I call you William? No, you don't look William to me at all. What was
your Hungarian name? I said, Vilmos.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:56:30 PM)
He said, What a beautiful, beautiful name, I will call you that. And
that's the credit on the movie. So he's my godfather, and I appreciate
him giving my name back to me.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:56:56 PM)
Incidentally Laszlo's name was Leslie in those days, and he became Laszlo
about the same time I became Vilmos.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:57:03 PM)
What is your best film cinematography from your point of view, and why?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:57:30 PM)
Tough question actually. I have so many films I really like. One year
I like this better, another year I like another film better.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:57:51 PM)
But objectively speaking, I think the best film all around for direction,
story, performances, cinematography - would be Deerhunter.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:58:08 PM)
That's first position. Then there are so many I could give you a list.
Close Encounters, McCabe & Mrs. Miller, The Rose,
Cinderella Liberty, Scarecrow. There are more, but all
these movies are very kind to me. I must say most of these movies were
shot in the '70s, or early '80s.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 2:59:18 PM)
In Seattle Film Festival there is going to be a retrospective of the
'70s movies, including The Hired Hand.
ShowBiz Expo Audience (Jun 1, 2002 2:59:26 PM)
You were honored in the Hungarian Parliament... How did you feel at
that time? And what would you want to leave to this world?
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 3:00:12 PM)
I was actually awarded in Hungary with the Corvin Chain, which was only
given to 12 people this year in Hungary. And I was the only filmmaker
who got this. Ever. I was very much honored. I'm very happy that finally
a filmmaker got an award like this, so they recognize film as an art
form.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 3:00:56 PM)
And what I'm going to leave behind, I think I'm going to leave the Corvin
Chain behind me because when I die, it goes to another person, but that
is probably the best thing I will leave behind.
Vilmos Zsigmond (Jun 1, 2002 3:01:53 PM)
Thanks very much for being here for this chat. I feel very honored to
have been here, and I wish good luck to all the students who were listening
and a good future. There is a good future in cinematography. Don't listen
to those people who say digital photography is going to kill it. It
won't because we won't let them do it to us.
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